OSR I never should have picked up Old School Essentials…

I play a lol of OSE because of how different the feel is thanks to the low power level. Makes it my go-to game for simple dungeon crawling, especially with small groups (running up to 4 characters each is a snap!).

I feel most at home with C&C though. Slightly stronger characters brining it up to a Tolkien like power level, unified resolution system that is easy to use and hack (SIEGE), and my favorite random treasure tables: no funny letters, it's organized by level; market value and xp for each item; value caps so you don't roll a +5 sword at level 2.

For the AD&D lovers though, I hope you have given Hyperboria a look. I think it's the best reimaging of that ruleset to date.

Mannahnin said:

2.5!

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TwoSix said:

The superior AD&D edition.

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I championed 2.5 for years (decades! ). When I was first introduced to it I loved the variability and options, and still do to a degree.

Combat and Tactics is a great sourcebook that cleans up 2nd Ed combat beautifully. I almost ported it back to 1e, but decided I'd rather parse out 1e combat and keep it distinct, which I'm glad I did.

What began to wear on me with 2.5 was that the options and 'builds' and such started to grate at my nerves. Players will be players, and always try to maximize things, and constantly pestered me about including this or that... it's like "you have 1000 options!" "yeah, but I want THIS option" "Well you can't have it!" "Waaaaaahhhh"

It was also quite a bear for new players, especially more casual players.

I'm pretty much done with 2e at this point, but if I went back I'd definitely restrict many things to the core books and only allow a handful of carefully selected aspects from Player's options systems. If you do that, and cultivate specific options for flavour it's a great sourcebook. But allowing 2.5 player's options full scale... nope never again.

AverageMojito said:

OSE/AF does have an AD&D-like rule for MU starting spells (based on INT score) and copying spells from scrolls and spellbooks (with % chance of success).

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Mannahnin said:

Right. This discussion was in the context of him saying that he was starting with just Basic OSE, and that he'd consider including Advanced elements once he had a chance to peruse them. I was suggesting that additional spell acquisition is worth including from the start.

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That's interesting, will definitely look into that when I get the AF books. Until then I'm going with the simple adjustment of giving Read Magic as the default, plus one other spell. Game is on tonight and 4 of 6 players have made Magic users as one of their stable of 3 characters. Offering Read Magic as a default to the M-U but not the Elf seemed to be instrumental in that decision process for 3 of them.

Mannahnin said:

Right. This discussion was in the context of him saying that he was starting with just Basic OSE, and that he'd consider including Advanced elements once he had a chance to peruse them. I was suggesting that additional spell acquisition is worth including from the start.

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I agree. It could be powerful drive, questing to acquire new spells. Additional starting spells also highlights the difference between a MU and an elf character. My point was to help inform @Musing Mage decision process by telling him the AF books have such a rule: it works with OSE/BX just fine.

Mezuka said:

I looked at it and even did a few solitary D&D sessions with it. It is really a well-made document. Much better than flipping back and forth through my old Basic and Expert books.

But ultimately I prefer the AD&D1e (Greyhawk) vibe of Castles & Crusades.

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…I should hate you. Your comment had me investigate it and, guess what? I just got the 8th printing PHB this week, was up past midnight reading it, and am now completely in love with it. My wife is going to kill me because I want to get other books and of course inflation is hurting our disposable income

Those class designs are phenomenal at capturing the class fantasy, there’s a lot more emphasis on things other than combat, and it makes me think this was the game I thought I was playing when I started playing in the early 90s.

Oh, boy, she is going to KILL me.

deganawida said:

My wife is going to kill me because I want to get other books and of course inflation is hurting our disposable income

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That's awesome! Great thing about C&C is you don't need a ton of books at all.

PHB and MM are all you need for years and years of gaming.

GM Guide for when you're ready to start tweaking the rules.

Player's Backpack and Mystical Companion when you're ready for more unique player options.

Adventurers and Historical Codices can be completely skipped IMO unless you're really a fan. As much as I like the game, the adventures are pretty rough around the edges and the Codices are pretty dry reads. Recommend making your own or pulling in other OSR material.

Oh, and don't forget to drop in their Discord. Great community over there.

I tried to actually fully read the rules for ships. I love sailing ships and it's always nice to see some thought put into them in fantasy. But his is ridiculous.

These ship tables are like the polearm classifications of AD&D. Who in their right mind would ever need such detail and granularity for a D&D. There's small ship, medium ship, and big ship, and they can go that far in a day and carry that many people. This is overkill.

Stuff like this makes me wish I was into OSE. I mean, look at how beautiful it is:

Grendel_Khan said:

Stuff like this makes me wish I was into OSE. I mean, look at how beautiful it is:

A Folklore Bestiary for 5E and OSE

An RPG Monsters Book Inspired by Folk Tales and Superstition

www.kickstarter.com

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That is kind of cool looking.

Grendel_Khan said:

Stuff like this makes me wish I was into OSE. I mean, look at how beautiful it is:

A Folklore Bestiary for 5E and OSE

An RPG Monsters Book Inspired by Folk Tales and Superstition

www.kickstarter.com

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It’s available for 5E as well.

overgeeked said:

It’s available for 5E as well.

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OSE is on my "maybe, one of these days" list.

5e is strictly in the "never again" column for me.