Level Up (A5E) Fast learner heritage feature and armor proficiency.

bigfaceless · Jun 13, 2024

The Fast Learner Human heritage feature is written as follows,

"Fast Learner. With their shorter life spans, humans can acquire knowledge at a higher rate than more long-lived heritages (although not all acquire the wisdom to use it). You gain proficiency in one additional skill of your choice. In addition, you require half as much time as normal to train yourself in the use of a suit of armor, tool, or weapon during downtime."

However, the downtime section does not list learning to use a suit of armor as an option. Was this changed during production or am I missing something?

How I've interpreted it is when learning armor proficiency through changing feats or class features that grant armor proficiency the feature applies but that feels a little too casual of a reading.

Dragongrief · Jun 13, 2024

I'd put it on the same time/cost as learning a weapon. Seems like the most comparable thing.

bigfaceless · Jun 13, 2024

Dragongrief said:
I'd put it on the same time/cost as learning a weapon. Seems like the most comparable thing.

This seems reasonable I'm just curious as to why it wasnt specifically mentioned in the training rules but it shows up in the heritage feature.

I've always wondered by there's no option for learning individual armors in o5e. Even classes only give you proficiency in categories of armor.

Distracted DM · Jun 14, 2024

bigfaceless said:
This seems reasonable I'm just curious as to why it wasnt specifically mentioned in the training rules but it shows up in the heritage feature.

I've always wondered by there's no option for learning individual armors in o5e. Even classes only give you proficiency in categories of armor.

bigfaceless said:
However, the downtime section does not list learning to use a suit of armor as an option. Was this changed during production or am I missing something?

How I've interpreted it is when learning armor proficiency through changing feats or class features that grant armor proficiency the feature applies but that feels a little too casual of a reading.

Great question! There are two possibilities that I can see:

1: They removed the possibility to train armors because it'll let mages etc. get heavy armor without mechanical investment- training in weapons is much less of a big deal than armor- and they forgot to remove that section of Fast Learner.
2: They forgot to add armor training to the training section of downtimes.

Personally I think it's 1, for the reasons given.

Micah Sweet · Jun 14, 2024

Distracted DM said:
Great question! There are two possibilities that I can see:

1: They removed the possibility to train armors because it'll let mages etc. get heavy armor without mechanical investment- training in weapons is much less of a big deal than armor- and they forgot to remove that section of Fast Learner.
2: They forgot to add armor training to the training section of downtimes.

Personally I think it's 1, for the reasons given.

1 isn't a good enough reason to exclude it to my mind. I'd certainly allow it.

Distracted DM · Jun 14, 2024

Micah Sweet said:
1 isn't a good enough reason to exclude it to my mind. I'd certainly allow it.

Oh I'm just reasoning what the RAI was- it's not a question of exclusion, but of inclusion. There aren't rules for training armor in downtime. You can certainly make the house-rule for it and tell the players at your table that they can do so

But I'd guess that it's a misprint in the heritage. I personally wouldn't add that house-rule to my games.

Selganor · Jun 15, 2024

Micah Sweet said:
1 isn't a good enough reason to exclude it to my mind. I'd certainly allow it.

Will you allow a character with the appropriate amount of time and money (100-150 gp and 4-6 months depending on if you got Str 11 or 12) to acquire medium armor proficiency before starting to play the character? (For example in a campaign that starts with higher gold at higher levelp) That would be a really cheap "permanent" mage armor effect.

Micah Sweet · Jun 15, 2024

Selganor said:
Will you allow a character with the appropriate amount of time and money (100-150 gp and 4-6 months depending on if you got Str 11 or 12) to acquire medium armor proficiency before starting to play the character? (For example in a campaign that starts with higher gold at higher levelp) That would be a really cheap "permanent" mage armor effect.

I suspect I would, if the PC had a good in-universe reason for it, and spent the resources.

Distracted DM · Jun 16, 2024

Micah Sweet said:
I suspect I would, if the PC had a good in-universe reason for it, and spent the resources.

I have players that think of in-universe concepts first and mechanics second, and I also have players that think of mechanics first and in-universe concepts second. Some of the latter would always find some justification to have whatever advantages they could get.

In short:
"I like cleric/paladin, I looked at the list of gods in the setting and think Heironeous is cool. I think Oath of Devotion matches a cleric/paladin of Heironeous, so I'll go with that."
vs
"I'm gonna be a wizard but want high AC so I'm going to take a level of artificer first for the armor and shield proficiencies- I can still keep my strength low because by the time I'll have plate armor I'll be able to cast Phantom Steed so my slower movement won't matter. I'm a jewelers apprentice first so that covers the artificer level, and then I was sent off to the wizard academy."

Dragongrief · Jun 16, 2024

Selganor said:
Will you allow a character with the appropriate amount of time and money (100-150 gp and 4-6 months depending on if you got Str 11 or 12) to acquire medium armor proficiency before starting to play the character? (For example in a campaign that starts with higher gold at higher levelp) That would be a really cheap "permanent" mage armor effect.

For most campaigns I wouldn't have an issue with them aquiring it.
Though it would be 200-300 gold (50/month), plus the cost of the specific armor learned, so it's unlikely to be a pre-playing thing unless the game starts at higher level.

Personal preference - I like the option of doing it that way rather than requiring multi-classing or a feat.

Level Up (A5E) Fast learner heritage feature and armor proficiency.

bigfaceless

Explorer

Dragongrief

Explorer

bigfaceless

Explorer

Distracted DM

Distracted DM

Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast

Distracted DM

Distracted DM

Selganor

Adventurer

Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast

Distracted DM

Distracted DM

Dragongrief

Explorer

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